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Post by redcocks on May 25, 2023 7:20:34 GMT -6
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Post by gemofthehills on May 25, 2023 7:41:35 GMT -6
Should not, CUSA nor JSU is expecting a huge decrease in revenue. With the TV deal being better than most expected and on par with MAC and SBC we should land where we expected.
WSU and the other PAC members appear to be looking forward to a substantial revenue reduction. This may effect JSU with more realignment but the chips will have to fall down a few ladder steps to get to us.
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Post by Whup Em All on May 25, 2023 8:29:47 GMT -6
The PAC took too long to negotiate their deal, and by the time they were serious about it, the conference had lost USC and UCLA. On top of that, every other major conference (except the ACC, which is locked in until 2035) had renegotiated and took all the prime TV slots.
So basically, they lost all the high dollar slots and two of the only three (arguably four) teams with enough national appeal to fill them. What's left is a glorified G5 league. If Oregon ever leaves, they're done.
CUSA was lucky enough to lose everyone and then replace them before the media deal was negotiated. We didn't get a high-end deal by any means, but it was an improvement over the (terrible, poorly negotiated) deal it replaced. And while we may have lost some "marquee" names, they are all mostly regional marquee names, not national names. (Let's face it... no one outside Alabama and Texas is going to tune in to watch UAB play UTSA.) So are we a "damaged brand"? Sure. But there's a big difference between losing Marshall, Southern Miss, ODU, UAB, UTSA, Rice, FAU, Charlotte, and UNT and losing USC and UCLA. Nine relative nobodies vs. two historical national heavyweights.
Put in simpler terms, there's probably a $2M-$5M difference between the media deal we signed vs. the one CUSA might've signed before the realignment apocalypse. Losing USC and UCLA cost the PAC *hundreds* of millions.
Bottom line: We'll be fine.
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Post by redcocks on May 25, 2023 9:06:09 GMT -6
The PAC took too long to negotiate their deal, and by the time they were serious about it, the conference had lost USC and UCLA. On top of that, every other major conference (except the ACC, which is locked in until 2035) had renegotiated and took all the prime TV slots. So basically, they lost all the high dollar slots and two of the only three (arguably four) teams with enough national appeal to fill them. What's left is a glorified G5 league. If Oregon ever leaves, they're done. CUSA was lucky enough to lose everyone and then replace them before the media deal was negotiated. We didn't get a high-end deal by any means, but it was an improvement over the (terrible, poorly negotiated) deal it replaced. And while we may have lost some "marquee" names, they are all mostly regional marquee names, not national names. (Let's face it... no one outside Alabama and Texas is going to tune in to watch UAB play UTSA.) So are we a "damaged brand"? Sure. But there's a big difference between losing Marshall, Southern Miss, ODU, UAB, UTSA, Rice, FAU, Charlotte, and UNT and losing USC and UCLA. Nine relative nobodies vs. two historical national heavyweights. Put in simpler terms, there's probably a $2M-$5M difference between the media deal we signed vs. the one CUSA might've signed before the realignment apocalypse. Losing USC and UCLA cost the PAC *hundreds* of millions. Bottom line: We'll be fine. Stupid question: Before the deal , was there any consideration given to the possibility of the Atlanta market ? Is it too soon to consider what KSU market would bring to viewership? We need to add eastern Kentucky just for another rivalry game and school .
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Post by jsumania on May 25, 2023 9:07:30 GMT -6
Should not, CUSA nor JSU is expecting a huge decrease in revenue. With the TV deal being better than most expected and on par with MAC and SBC we should land where we expected. WSU and the other PAC members appear to be looking forward to a substantial revenue reduction. This may effect JSU with more realignment but the chips will have to fall down a few ladder steps to get to us. I do believe we're on par with the MAC, which is great, considering they're a well-established FBS conference. The Sports Business Journal shows that the SBC makes at least $1.2 million per school though. And apparently their re-done ESPN deal lets them keep the money they'd normally spend on broadcasting (or something like that, I can't remember exactly), so it gives them a little extra and goes up to roughly $1.8 million.
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Post by smith79jordan on May 25, 2023 9:36:43 GMT -6
The PAC took too long to negotiate their deal, and by the time they were serious about it, the conference had lost USC and UCLA. On top of that, every other major conference (except the ACC, which is locked in until 2035) had renegotiated and took all the prime TV slots. So basically, they lost all the high dollar slots and two of the only three (arguably four) teams with enough national appeal to fill them. What's left is a glorified G5 league. If Oregon ever leaves, they're done. CUSA was lucky enough to lose everyone and then replace them before the media deal was negotiated. We didn't get a high-end deal by any means, but it was an improvement over the (terrible, poorly negotiated) deal it replaced. And while we may have lost some "marquee" names, they are all mostly regional marquee names, not national names. (Let's face it... no one outside Alabama and Texas is going to tune in to watch UAB play UTSA.) So are we a "damaged brand"? Sure. But there's a big difference between losing Marshall, Southern Miss, ODU, UAB, UTSA, Rice, FAU, Charlotte, and UNT and losing USC and UCLA. Nine relative nobodies vs. two historical national heavyweights. Put in simpler terms, there's probably a $2M-$5M difference between the media deal we signed vs. the one CUSA might've signed before the realignment apocalypse. Losing USC and UCLA cost the PAC *hundreds* of millions. Bottom line: We'll be fine. Stupid question: Before the deal , was there any consideration given to the possibility of the Atlanta market ? Is it too soon to consider what KSU market would bring to viewership? We need to add eastern Kentucky just for another rivalry game and school . I doubt Kennesaw State would've been considered without us first being invited. They average 2K fans, so the idea that their effect on the Atlanta TV market is negligible at best. KSU gives the distant school more bang for their buck when they come play us. We're 90 miles from each other, and in close proximity to the Atlanta Airport that can connect anywhere in the US. As for EKU, I think they're on standby for if WKU gets poached. If we add anyone, it'll be a western school to help out Sam Houston and their distant neighbors.
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Post by toooldtocare on May 25, 2023 9:45:45 GMT -6
Somewhere/sometime (can’t remember) I was told the CUSA football rights total $750k per member.
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Post by Whup Em All on May 25, 2023 10:56:48 GMT -6
Stupid question: Before the deal , was there any consideration given to the possibility of the Atlanta market ? Is it too soon to consider what KSU market would bring to viewership? We need to add eastern Kentucky just for another rivalry game and school . I doubt Kennesaw State would've been considered without us first being invited. They average 2K fans, so the idea that their effect on the Atlanta TV market is negligible at best. KSU gives the distant school more bang for their buck when they come play us. We're 90 miles from each other, and in close proximity to the Atlanta Airport that can connect anywhere in the US. Kennesaw was already on the table when the deal was negotiated, so any impact they had on the deal was, well, included in the deal. But I agree with smith79jordan ... KSU's effect on the ATL market is very, very negligible. I think the main attraction for adding them to CUSA (apart from solidifying the center of the conference footprint) was to gain access to the greater ATL recruiting market. It's huge for football, basketball, AND baseball. CUSA needed it. I wish I could pick the conference leadership's brain to see where their priorities really lie. If they want to increase fan excitement, their two best choices for expansion are EKU and SFA. One provides a historical rival for WKU, a longtime rival for JSU, and a potential rival for Liberty, KSU, and MTSU. The other provides a historical rival for SHSU and a potential rival for La Tech. (As well as a familiar foe in JSU.) But if they instead want to break the conference into geographical divisions (which would be great for travel budgets) both schools need to be in the West. At this point, Tarleton and Mo State enter the chat with SFA, and EKU is asked to sit with the children in the WACASUN for the foreseeable future. If they want to expand the footprint and add "prestige" they'll go with Mo State and Delaware as their top 2 options. (Both are flagships and, across all sports, perform better than any other candidates.) Neither would really excite fans or help travel for anybody, but who cares about fans and saving money, amirite? If any of the above schools aren't interested (or for some other reason don't qualify) they'll look to other candidates, including, but not limited to, and in no particular order, McNeese, UCA, Abilene Christian, an HBCU such as Jackson State or NCAT, or football-only candidates (not a popular option) such as NDSU/SDSU or (ugh...) UMass/UConn. And then there's the ever-present possibility they choose NOT to expand to 12, and just roll with 10. While travel takes a beating with this option, there are fewer mouths to feed, so the per-school revenue from CFP and NCAA Tourney payouts goes up. And let's not forget that both the current and future media deals will likely involve network execs in any expansion discussions. This is what brought USC and UCLA to the Big Ten. If we left it entirely up to the network execs, our next two members could be Monmouth and Cal Poly. Those network guys aren't very bright.
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Post by gemofthehills on May 25, 2023 11:53:34 GMT -6
Should not, CUSA nor JSU is expecting a huge decrease in revenue. With the TV deal being better than most expected and on par with MAC and SBC we should land where we expected. WSU and the other PAC members appear to be looking forward to a substantial revenue reduction. This may effect JSU with more realignment but the chips will have to fall down a few ladder steps to get to us. I do believe we're on par with the MAC, which is great, considering they're a well-established FBS conference. The Sports Business Journal shows that the SBC makes at least $1.2 million per school though. And apparently their re-done ESPN deal lets them keep the money they'd normally spend on broadcasting (or something like that, I can't remember exactly), so it gives them a little extra and goes up to roughly $1.8 million. According to ON3 it $500,000 per for the SBC. www.on3.com/news/conference-tv-deals-current-status-college-football/24/7 says $500,000 per team in SBC. This one doesnt have CUSAs new deal. 247sports.com/Article/ACC-Pac-12-conference-expansion-realignment-TV-contract-deals-205637161/The Athletic has CUSA at $750,000 theathletic.com/3783834/2022/11/09/conference-usa-espn-cbs-deal/Do hear reports of higher amounts for both leagues but it is normal conference payout which includes additional funds. Forum boards have SBC at 2 million but havent seen any real reports to confirm and it seems high.
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Post by troysux on May 25, 2023 12:31:34 GMT -6
To have a huge drop in revenue you need to have a huge amount of revenue to begin with. Not a problem in CUSA.
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Post by brother on May 25, 2023 13:09:16 GMT -6
I doubt Kennesaw State would've been considered without us first being invited. They average 2K fans, so the idea that their effect on the Atlanta TV market is negligible at best. KSU gives the distant school more bang for their buck when they come play us. We're 90 miles from each other, and in close proximity to the Atlanta Airport that can connect anywhere in the US. Kennesaw was already on the table when the deal was negotiated, so any impact they had on the deal was, well, included in the deal. But I agree with smith79jordan ... KSU's effect on the ATL market is very, very negligible. I think the main attraction for adding them to CUSA (apart from solidifying the center of the conference footprint) was to gain access to the greater ATL recruiting market. It's huge for football, basketball, AND baseball. CUSA needed it. I wish I could pick the conference leadership's brain to see where their priorities really lie. If they want to increase fan excitement, their two best choices for expansion are EKU and SFA. One provides a historical rival for WKU, a longtime rival for JSU, and a potential rival for Liberty, KSU, and MTSU. The other provides a historical rival for SHSU and a potential rival for La Tech. (As well as a familiar foe in JSU.) But if they instead want to break the conference into geographical divisions (which would be great for travel budgets) both schools need to be in the West. At this point, Tarleton and Mo State enter the chat with SFA, and EKU is asked to sit with the children in the WACASUN for the foreseeable future. If they want to expand the footprint and add "prestige" they'll go with Mo State and Delaware as their top 2 options. (Both are flagships and, across all sports, perform better than any other candidates.) Neither would really excite fans or help travel for anybody, but who cares about fans and saving money, amirite? If any of the above schools aren't interested (or for some other reason don't qualify) they'll look to other candidates, including, but not limited to, and in no particular order, McNeese, UCA, Abilene Christian, an HBCU such as Jackson State or NCAT, or football-only candidates (not a popular option) such as NDSU/SDSU or (ugh...) UMass/UConn. And then there's the ever-present possibility they choose NOT to expand to 12, and just roll with 10. While travel takes a beating with this option, there are fewer mouths to feed, so the per-school revenue from CFP and NCAA Tourney payouts goes up. And let's not forget that both the current and future media deals will likely involve network execs in any expansion discussions. This is what brought USC and UCLA to the Big Ten. If we left it entirely up to the network execs, our next two members could be Monmouth and Cal Poly. Those network guys aren't very bright. I don’t think EKU is going to be considered. It almost guarantees that WKU would leave as soon as possible. They don’t look at that rivalry the way that we do.
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Post by Whup Em All on May 25, 2023 14:12:24 GMT -6
I don’t think EKU is going to be considered. It almost guarantees that WKU would leave as soon as possible. They don’t look at that rivalry the way that we do. Only problem for WKU is, to leave, they need somewhere to go. And right now, no one wants them. And if someone DID want them, and invited them, they'd leave, whether we invite EKU or not. MTSU is happier with CUSA. I think they'd only leave for the AAC, and most of their fans aren't optimistic that invitation will ever come. Liberty would leave for the AAC or Sun Belt (due to regional rivals) but, again, most of their fans aren't very optimistic they'll get an invite. FIU would love to leave for the AAC, but the AAC can't stop laughing long enough to tell them there's no way in hell that's happening. La Tech has nowhere to go. They're stuck in CUSA with all the rest of us losers. Really, the only schools with a semi-realistic shot of leaving are UTEP/NMSU to the MWC (but that would require a LOT of PAC-related dominoes to fall).
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Post by sprout203 on May 25, 2023 15:01:06 GMT -6
I doubt Kennesaw State would've been considered without us first being invited. They average 2K fans, so the idea that their effect on the Atlanta TV market is negligible at best. KSU gives the distant school more bang for their buck when they come play us. We're 90 miles from each other, and in close proximity to the Atlanta Airport that can connect anywhere in the US. And then there's the ever-present possibility they choose NOT to expand to 12, and just roll with 10. While travel takes a beating with this option, there are fewer mouths to feed, so the per-school revenue from CFP and NCAA Tourney payouts goes up. Hypothetically, which would have more "money games"? A 10 or 12 team league.
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Post by Cleburneslim on May 25, 2023 21:05:04 GMT -6
I don’t think EKU is going to be considered. It almost guarantees that WKU would leave as soon as possible. They don’t look at that rivalry the way that we do. Only problem for WKU is, to leave, they need somewhere to go. And right now, no one wants them. And if someone DID want them, and invited them, they'd leave, whether we invite EKU or not. MTSU is happier with CUSA. I think they'd only leave for the AAC, and most of their fans aren't optimistic that invitation will ever come. Liberty would leave for the AAC or Sun Belt (due to regional rivals) but, again, most of their fans aren't very optimistic they'll get an invite. FIU would love to leave for the AAC, but the AAC can't stop laughing long enough to tell them there's no way in hell that's happening. La Tech has nowhere to go. They're stuck in CUSA with all the rest of us losers. Really, the only schools with a semi-realistic shot of leaving are UTEP/NMSU to the MWC (but that would require a LOT of PAC-related dominoes to fall). I'm not sure liberty would take a sbc invite.
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Post by Cleburneslim on May 25, 2023 21:20:44 GMT -6
Kennesaw was already on the table when the deal was negotiated, so any impact they had on the deal was, well, included in the deal. But I agree with smith79jordan ... KSU's effect on the ATL market is very, very negligible. I think the main attraction for adding them to CUSA (apart from solidifying the center of the conference footprint) was to gain access to the greater ATL recruiting market. It's huge for football, basketball, AND baseball. CUSA needed it. I wish I could pick the conference leadership's brain to see where their priorities really lie. If they want to increase fan excitement, their two best choices for expansion are EKU and SFA. One provides a historical rival for WKU, a longtime rival for JSU, and a potential rival for Liberty, KSU, and MTSU. The other provides a historical rival for SHSU and a potential rival for La Tech. (As well as a familiar foe in JSU.) But if they instead want to break the conference into geographical divisions (which would be great for travel budgets) both schools need to be in the West. At this point, Tarleton and Mo State enter the chat with SFA, and EKU is asked to sit with the children in the WACASUN for the foreseeable future. If they want to expand the footprint and add "prestige" they'll go with Mo State and Delaware as their top 2 options. (Both are flagships and, across all sports, perform better than any other candidates.) Neither would really excite fans or help travel for anybody, but who cares about fans and saving money, amirite? If any of the above schools aren't interested (or for some other reason don't qualify) they'll look to other candidates, including, but not limited to, and in no particular order, McNeese, UCA, Abilene Christian, an HBCU such as Jackson State or NCAT, or football-only candidates (not a popular option) such as NDSU/SDSU or (ugh...) UMass/UConn. And then there's the ever-present possibility they choose NOT to expand to 12, and just roll with 10. While travel takes a beating with this option, there are fewer mouths to feed, so the per-school revenue from CFP and NCAA Tourney payouts goes up. And let's not forget that both the current and future media deals will likely involve network execs in any expansion discussions. This is what brought USC and UCLA to the Big Ten. If we left it entirely up to the network execs, our next two members could be Monmouth and Cal Poly. Those network guys aren't very bright. I don’t think EKU is going to be considered. It almost guarantees that WKU would leave as soon as possible. They don’t look at that rivalry the way that we do. I believe utep and nmsu is on their way to the mwc. I don't see how this isn't gonna happen. Cusa could put Florida in the west. Seems dumb but the distance is so great, it is irrelevant which division they are in, especially since there appears to be no one we could add to shorten the trip or a travel partner. Therefore we could add a western and an eastern school. I believe we should add eastward even if it's western school. As I said the far western schools are likely gone.
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