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Post by brother on Oct 26, 2023 13:55:40 GMT -6
A few notes about FIU... 1) A large part of the crappy attendance is the fact that students at Florida International University are, in fact, international, and have no ingrained love for American football. That is, it's not that they don't watch FIU because they grew up in a Miami Hurricane family. It's that their families don't watch American football at all. I mean, there are exceptions, obviously. For heaven's sake, not every family in Alabama watches the Tide, Tigers, or [insert other SEC team]. Some would much rather watch Real Madrid on cable than watch anything involving an oblong spheroid. But just as MOST folks in Alabama grew up with football on the TV on Saturdays, MOST FIU students don't share that tradition. 2) For the past several years, FIU has been the absolute doormat of FBS college football. Terrible doesn't begin to describe their ineptitude. It's hard to pull in fans with that kind of history. Mike Macintyre has a big rebuilding job in front of him. He's actually made some strides in recruiting and some other areas, but they're just soooooo bad in soooooo many areas across the board, the odds are stacked against him. If he can keep some of those young guys in the program and continue recruiting well, they could turn the corner (a la NMSU) within a couple years. 3) Who am I kidding? FIU's attendance sucks even when they're decent at the game of football. Back in 2010, when Mario Cristobal coached them to a co-championship in the MIGHTY SUN BELT, they averaged a *reported* 16,000 per game. If last night's game was reported at 14K, then we can reasonably assume they averaged about 2,000 in actual attendance in 2010. For perspective, they pull in an actual 1,500 for men's soccer. 4) I like their band. I mean, yes, they're small and have very little tradition behind them, but they know their crowd and recruiting grounds. (Unlike some other schools I could mention with young bands without tradition. Coughcoughkennesaw.) If I were a band director in south Florida, you can bet your bottom dollar I'd be going after those kids who were raised on Cuban salsa, rhumba, and Spanish fusion. We'd play a steady stream of Latin jazz like Malaguena, Malaga, La Fiesta, Firedance, Spirit of the Bull, and just blow the stands back each and every show. Most of all, it'd be fun, both for the band kids and for the crowd. Every show would be a fiesta. Based on what I've seen of the FIU band on the field, that's sort of what they're going for. I hope in time they can get their numbers up, but they're hampered a bit by that crappy football team. 5) I thought their field looked terrible on TV. Hearing that it looks that bad in person is just ... shocking. Football fields can be a lot of things in this day and age, but they should never be shiny. 6) There is a solid use for qualified, decently well-trained event staff. When there IS a need for them -- some jackwagon is in your reserved seats and gives you attitude when you ask him to move -- knowing you can flag down someone in an orange vest to give you backup is a nice benefit. But that's where it should end. They should check tickets as you walk into a reserved section, and then never bother anyone in that section again, except in the aforementioned case. If they think their job is to repeatedly police a section to keep out all the riff-raff, then they don't understand their job. Shame on them, and shame on the school/venue that employs them. 7) FIU was originally the Sunblazers, but was changed in 1987 to the "Golden Panthers" and then shortened to "Panthers" in 2010, as the school became more and more generic and forgettable. But in the glory years of the mid-80s, they were featured on an episode of Miami Vice (as the Sunblazers), forever sealing both the mascot and the logo in the minds of every FIU fan as the best thing ever to come out of their alma mater. In recent years, a push from both alumni and current students to ditch the Generic Panther logo and return to their roots has taken hold. The university paid homage to their original identity last night as part of a "Way Back Wednesday" promotion. That's why the Panthers were Sunblazers again for a night. 8) If they return to their Sunblazers identity, I would hope they'd modernize the logo. At the very least, they need to change their field to a different color that's more complimentary of that ugly 80s sun. It looked awful last night. 9) I hate that the refs blew that call, even though it was to our benefit, because now folks are saying we only won because the refs were in our corner. C'mon man. Watch the first quarter, which was the finest quarter of football the Gamecock football team has ever played, across all phases of the game, and tell me the refs had ANYTHING to do with that. Heck, FIU even benefitted from an personal foul against the Gamecocks which, even though it was the proper call, was not your typical "personal foul" kind of infraction. (Our guy was clearly swatting at the ball and came down on the QB. Yes, he hit him. Yes, he made contact with the head. No, it was not intentional. Proper call, though.) 10) I hate that the Gamecocks lost their way for about half the game after the 2nd quarter began. But in a way, I'm glad. I don't know how motivated I would've been to watch us soar to a 90-0 win. I appreciate the intrigue. To your point #9, you must have missed King's post about the rule on that play. It was actually the correct call.
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Post by Whup Em All on Oct 26, 2023 14:28:53 GMT -6
9) I hate that the refs blew that call, even though it was to our benefit, because now folks are saying we only won because the refs were in our corner. C'mon man. Watch the first quarter, which was the finest quarter of football the Gamecock football team has ever played, across all phases of the game, and tell me the refs had ANYTHING to do with that. Heck, FIU even benefitted from an personal foul against the Gamecocks which, even though it was the proper call, was not your typical "personal foul" kind of infraction. (Our guy was clearly swatting at the ball and came down on the QB. Yes, he hit him. Yes, he made contact with the head. No, it was not intentional. Proper call, though.) To your point #9, you must have missed King's post about the rule on that play. It was actually the correct call. Ah. I had missed it. I actually saw someone post that rule on social media, but they left off the vital words "a reasonable opportunity to catch the ball before it hits the ground" so it seemed like the announcers were right. (In all fairness, Galban did miff it, and has looked sketchy all season returning punts for some reason.) I figured the announcers were correct -- he'd obviously had the ball bounce away from him, so no interference. But the ball hadn't hit the ground, so... I take back what I said about the refs. Excellent job, guys.
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Post by King_Gamecock on Oct 26, 2023 19:07:27 GMT -6
A few notes about FIU... 1) A large part of the crappy attendance is the fact that students at Florida International University are, in fact, international, and have no ingrained love for American football. That is, it's not that they don't watch FIU because they grew up in a Miami Hurricane family. It's that their families don't watch American football at all. I mean, there are exceptions, obviously. For heaven's sake, not every family in Alabama watches the Tide, Tigers, or [insert other SEC team]. Some would much rather watch Real Madrid on cable than watch anything involving an oblong spheroid. But just as MOST folks in Alabama grew up with football on the TV on Saturdays, MOST FIU students don't share that tradition. 2) For the past several years, FIU has been the absolute doormat of FBS college football. Terrible doesn't begin to describe their ineptitude. It's hard to pull in fans with that kind of history. Mike Macintyre has a big rebuilding job in front of him. He's actually made some strides in recruiting and some other areas, but they're just soooooo bad in soooooo many areas across the board, the odds are stacked against him. If he can keep some of those young guys in the program and continue recruiting well, they could turn the corner (a la NMSU) within a couple years. 3) Who am I kidding? FIU's attendance sucks even when they're decent at the game of football. Back in 2010, when Mario Cristobal coached them to a co-championship in the MIGHTY SUN BELT, they averaged a *reported* 16,000 per game. If last night's game was reported at 14K, then we can reasonably assume they averaged about 2,000 in actual attendance in 2010. For perspective, they pull in an actual 1,500 for men's soccer. 4) I like their band. I mean, yes, they're small and have very little tradition behind them, but they know their crowd and recruiting grounds. (Unlike some other schools I could mention with young bands without tradition. Coughcoughkennesaw.) If I were a band director in south Florida, you can bet your bottom dollar I'd be going after those kids who were raised on Cuban salsa, rhumba, and Spanish fusion. We'd play a steady stream of Latin jazz like Malaguena, Malaga, La Fiesta, Firedance, Spirit of the Bull, and just blow the stands back each and every show. Most of all, it'd be fun, both for the band kids and for the crowd. Every show would be a fiesta. Based on what I've seen of the FIU band on the field, that's sort of what they're going for. I hope in time they can get their numbers up, but they're hampered a bit by that crappy football team. 5) I thought their field looked terrible on TV. Hearing that it looks that bad in person is just ... shocking. Football fields can be a lot of things in this day and age, but they should never be shiny. 6) There is a solid use for qualified, decently well-trained event staff. When there IS a need for them -- some jackwagon is in your reserved seats and gives you attitude when you ask him to move -- knowing you can flag down someone in an orange vest to give you backup is a nice benefit. But that's where it should end. They should check tickets as you walk into a reserved section, and then never bother anyone in that section again, except in the aforementioned case. If they think their job is to repeatedly police a section to keep out all the riff-raff, then they don't understand their job. Shame on them, and shame on the school/venue that employs them. 7) FIU was originally the Sunblazers, but was changed in 1987 to the "Golden Panthers" and then shortened to "Panthers" in 2010, as the school became more and more generic and forgettable. But in the glory years of the mid-80s, they were featured on an episode of Miami Vice (as the Sunblazers), forever sealing both the mascot and the logo in the minds of every FIU fan as the best thing ever to come out of their alma mater. In recent years, a push from both alumni and current students to ditch the Generic Panther logo and return to their roots has taken hold. The university paid homage to their original identity last night as part of a "Way Back Wednesday" promotion. That's why the Panthers were Sunblazers again for a night. 8) If they return to their Sunblazers identity, I would hope they'd modernize the logo. At the very least, they need to change their field to a different color that's more complimentary of that ugly 80s sun. It looked awful last night. 9) I hate that (people think) the refs blew that call, even though it was to our benefit, because now folks are saying we only won because the refs were in our corner. C'mon man. Watch the first quarter, which was the finest quarter of football the Gamecock football team has ever played, across all phases of the game, and tell me the refs had ANYTHING to do with that. Heck, FIU even benefitted from an personal foul against the Gamecocks which, even though it was the proper call, was not your typical "personal foul" kind of infraction. (Our guy was clearly swatting at the ball and came down on the QB. Yes, he hit him. Yes, he made contact with the head. No, it was not intentional. Proper call, though.) 10) I hate that the Gamecocks lost their way for about half the game after the 2nd quarter began. But in a way, I'm glad. I don't know how motivated I would've been to watch us soar to a 90-0 win. I appreciate the intrigue. Kenny is an enigma to me. I honestly thought when they started the program that they would be a thorn in The Marching Southerner's side. Kenny is situated right in the middle of some of the strongest high school band programs in the nation - which also happens to be where JSU draws heavily from. I really expected them to be a powerhouse marching band overnight. I guess it is a good example of how the director really does make a difference. If you consider when KB took over at JSU, the Southerners were on a steep decline under FSM - who I consider to be the marching band equivalent of Voldemort. Some people liked FSM, but I wasn't one of them. He wanted to systematically deconstruct what made us who we were. I remember him telling the 20-J's that he was working on getting us sousaphones so we could quit marching those antiques. Yeah, that happened. Handing out sheet music with "Fresno State Bulldog Band" printed on the top didn't help morale. I remember how terrible the arrangement was for Officer Krupke. It wasn't that it was difficult, it was just bad... we had to cut it from early shows because we couldn't perform it cleanly, and played Malaguena / Spirit of the Bull instead... so we had this weird hybrid of West Side Story and Malaguena. I love West Side Story... but that show was just unpleasant, and the rotating cube we did to start was a mess. I don't think we ever got it clean. We had some great players, but we weren't a good ensemble, and that started at the top. Within 3 years of taking over, Bodiford had re-established The Southerners, and the 25 years since then have been pretty remarkable. There are down sides to being the largest marching band in America... the music never sounds perfectly clean, and the drill is kind of limited due to the number of people... but the shows are great and The Southerners have become legendary with reaction videos from around the world and massive awareness.
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Post by Whup Em All on Oct 27, 2023 8:20:38 GMT -6
Kenny is an enigma to me. I honestly thought when they started the program that they would be a thorn in The Marching Southerner's side. Kenny is situated right in the middle of some of the strongest high school band programs in the nation - which also happens to be where JSU draws heavily from. I really expected them to be a powerhouse marching band overnight. I guess it is a good example of how the director really does make a difference. If you consider when KB took over at JSU, the Southerners were on a steep decline under FSM - who I consider to be the marching band equivalent of Voldemort. Some people liked FSM, but I wasn't one of them. He wanted to systematically deconstruct what made us who we were. I remember him telling the 20-J's that he was working on getting us sousaphones so we could quit marching those antiques. Yeah, that happened. Handing out sheet music with "Fresno State Bulldog Band" printed on the top didn't help morale. I remember how terrible the arrangement was for Officer Krupke. It wasn't that it was difficult, it was just bad... we had to cut it from early shows because we couldn't perform it cleanly, and played Malaguena / Spirit of the Bull instead... so we had this weird hybrid of West Side Story and Malaguena. I love West Side Story... but that show was just unpleasant, and the rotating cube we did to start was a mess. I don't think we ever got it clean. We had some great players, but we weren't a good ensemble, and that started at the top. Within 3 years of taking over, Bodiford had re-established The Southerners, and the 25 years since then have been pretty remarkable. There are down sides to being the largest marching band in America... the music never sounds perfectly clean, and the drill is kind of limited due to the number of people... but the shows are great and The Southerners have become legendary with reaction videos from around the world and massive awareness. FSM elevated the indoor program. I'll give him that. He took a strong symphonic band, made it smaller (i.e., much tougher to get into), called it the "Wind Ensemble", and pretty much shut up all the talk about Jax State "having a great marching program but no indoor program" that had been emanating from such places as Pike County. His marching bands, on the other hand, were so much less than they could have been. The '91 and '92 bands were chock full of talent. It still amazes me how great some of the individual musicians from that era were. The '91 show was uneven and clearly written for someone else. Krupke was the worst all-time choice for a Ballerina tune ever in the history of the planet. Without question. I mean, even if you liked the arrangement, you have to admit it's not exactly ideal for a kickline. And few people liked the arrangement. We swapped it out for Mambo, which wasn't much better. (BTW, it wasn't Malaguena in '91... it was Spanish Dreams, with a One More Time Chuck Corea tag. A really odd fit in the middle of a West Side Story show.) I do like the '92 show. I thought things were coming together a little bit... a Blue Devils opener and concert number and a Cadets closer. It's hard to go wrong with that. If he'd started things off with that, instead of West Side Story, the outcome might've been different. But then things went all to hell in 1993. He was determined to program a "crowd-pleasing" show and his grad assistants (who it turns out are both now considered moderate legends in the drum corps world) had zero familiarity and respect for the Marching Southerners. (I'm speaking from what was said to me directly; no assumptions here.) "We weren't as good as we think" apparently, and after all, "It's just college band." On top of that, FSM had seen a "student-run" band before, and it was ugly. He wasn't going to be director of Stanford East. So any suggestions from the students were dismissed immediately. "I appreciate your concern for our esprit de corps." (Actual quote to me, after I warned him in early summer that programming "I Will Follow Him" from "Sister Act" was a bad idea and wouldn't end well.) Narrator: It didn't end well. It was just a bad fit all around. Kids today don't know how good they've got it. (GET OFF MY LAWN!) As for Kenny... I felt the same as you when it was announced they were launching football. "That band is going to be a problem." Instead, they hired a director who (by choice or by directive) chose to go with generic "crowd-pleasing" shows rather than pushing the envelope with classical and jazz. It kills me when bands do this. UAB did the same. (The case of UAB's band was directed from on high, from what I understand. The school administration went so far with their micromanaging as to require all colorguard flags be the official school colors at all times. I wonder if Kennesaw's administration made the same stupid mistake.) Regardless of how it happened, instead of Southerners having to recruit against a corps-style behemoth on our eastern flank, we just have Kenny and Ga State over there. Both are what Douglas Adams would've called "Mostly Harmless." You have to keep driving another 150 miles northeast to Cullowhee before you get to actual "competition" for the Southerners. Honestly, our biggest competition right now is probably Auburn, who's turned things up quite a few notches since the old days. (Their Metallica show from last weekend is actually pretty awesome and worth the watch.) Still not a corps-style band, but at least they're good.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2023 10:46:40 GMT -6
My old band director talked about getting laughed off the field by high school bands during the dark year.
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Post by King_Gamecock on Oct 27, 2023 20:03:56 GMT -6
Kenny is an enigma to me. I honestly thought when they started the program that they would be a thorn in The Marching Southerner's side. Kenny is situated right in the middle of some of the strongest high school band programs in the nation - which also happens to be where JSU draws heavily from. I really expected them to be a powerhouse marching band overnight. I guess it is a good example of how the director really does make a difference. If you consider when KB took over at JSU, the Southerners were on a steep decline under FSM - who I consider to be the marching band equivalent of Voldemort. Some people liked FSM, but I wasn't one of them. He wanted to systematically deconstruct what made us who we were. I remember him telling the 20-J's that he was working on getting us sousaphones so we could quit marching those antiques. Yeah, that happened. Handing out sheet music with "Fresno State Bulldog Band" printed on the top didn't help morale. I remember how terrible the arrangement was for Officer Krupke. It wasn't that it was difficult, it was just bad... we had to cut it from early shows because we couldn't perform it cleanly, and played Malaguena / Spirit of the Bull instead... so we had this weird hybrid of West Side Story and Malaguena. I love West Side Story... but that show was just unpleasant, and the rotating cube we did to start was a mess. I don't think we ever got it clean. We had some great players, but we weren't a good ensemble, and that started at the top. Within 3 years of taking over, Bodiford had re-established The Southerners, and the 25 years since then have been pretty remarkable. There are down sides to being the largest marching band in America... the music never sounds perfectly clean, and the drill is kind of limited due to the number of people... but the shows are great and The Southerners have become legendary with reaction videos from around the world and massive awareness. FSM elevated the indoor program. I'll give him that. He took a strong symphonic band, made it smaller (i.e., much tougher to get into), called it the "Wind Ensemble", and pretty much shut up all the talk about Jax State "having a great marching program but no indoor program" that had been emanating from such places as Pike County. His marching bands, on the other hand, were so much less than they could have been. The '91 and '92 bands were chock full of talent. It still amazes me how great some of the individual musicians from that era were. The '91 show was uneven and clearly written for someone else. Krupke was the worst all-time choice for a Ballerina tune ever in the history of the planet. Without question. I mean, even if you liked the arrangement, you have to admit it's not exactly ideal for a kickline. And few people liked the arrangement. We swapped it out for Mambo, which wasn't much better. (BTW, it wasn't Malaguena in '91... it was Spanish Dreams, with a One More Time Chuck Corea tag. A really odd fit in the middle of a West Side Story show.) I do like the '92 show. I thought things were coming together a little bit... a Blue Devils opener and concert number and a Cadets closer. It's hard to go wrong with that. If he'd started things off with that, instead of West Side Story, the outcome might've been different. But then things went all to hell in 1993. He was determined to program a "crowd-pleasing" show and his grad assistants (who it turns out are both now considered moderate legends in the drum corps world) had zero familiarity and respect for the Marching Southerners. (I'm speaking from what was said to me directly; no assumptions here.) "We weren't as good as we think" apparently, and after all, "It's just college band." On top of that, FSM had seen a "student-run" band before, and it was ugly. He wasn't going to be director of Stanford East. So any suggestions from the students were dismissed immediately. "I appreciate your concern for our esprit de corps." (Actual quote to me, after I warned him in early summer that programming "I Will Follow Him" from "Sister Act" was a bad idea and wouldn't end well.) Narrator: It didn't end well. It was just a bad fit all around. Kids today don't know how good they've got it. (GET OFF MY LAWN!) As for Kenny... I felt the same as you when it was announced they were launching football. "That band is going to be a problem." Instead, they hired a director who (by choice or by directive) chose to go with generic "crowd-pleasing" shows rather than pushing the envelope with classical and jazz. It kills me when bands do this. UAB did the same. (The case of UAB's band was directed from on high, from what I understand. The school administration went so far with their micromanaging as to require all colorguard flags be the official school colors at all times. I wonder if Kennesaw's administration made the same stupid mistake.) Regardless of how it happened, instead of Southerners having to recruit against a corps-style behemoth on our eastern flank, we just have Kenny and Ga State over there. Both are what Douglas Adams would've called "Mostly Harmless." You have to keep driving another 150 miles northeast to Cullowhee before you get to actual "competition" for the Southerners. Honestly, our biggest competition right now is probably Auburn, who's turned things up quite a few notches since the old days. (Their Metallica show from last weekend is actually pretty awesome and worth the watch.) Still not a corps-style band, but at least they're good. Shows you the mental block I have on 91...I had forgotten the Chick Corea tag and was remembering it as Malaguena... And I marched it. I dropped in 92 because it was announced we would be playing Mountain Music. I asked FSM if it was Hovhaness or Grieg. He said Alabama! I went straight to the academic offices and dropped. It was after band camp and I hated doing it, but I wasn't having fun that year and I didn't sign up to play country. Edit: I guess I should clarify... It wasn't so much that we were playing Alabama as it was FSM's attitude when I asked him about it.
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