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Post by gemofthehills on Jun 26, 2023 8:19:06 GMT -6
Might be the players answer to the NIL issue. Take the lead from Middle and take control for yourself.
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Post by Cleburneslim on Jun 27, 2023 15:44:22 GMT -6
The free market would determine the value of each athlete and only the most marketable athletes would really be affected. The problem with this is, it takes more than a "marketable" QB or star WR or EDGE to win. Teams need linemen on both sides of the ball, who, except at the absolute top of the scale (i.e., future Top 5 draft picks) operate in relative anonymity. And those guys aren't going to collect anything without some form of teamwide collective. The only exceptions might be those schools who have a "War Pigs" style nickname for a unit that might pull in some corporate interest. The same goes for individual jersey sales, etc. Your starting QB might sell thousands of dollars worth of his NIL gear, but unless you have the next Gronk on your team, your starting TE will only sell a fraction of that. And most coaches want a TE who can get the job done, whether he's Gronk or not. So schools which are able start collectives which in turn pay competitive "salaries" to every scholarship player, proven or not. The schools at the top of the food chain take it a step farther, and provide what amounts to signing bonuses, which can reach 6 or even 7 figures for prized recruits. This is the part that's gotten totally out of hand. I've seen proposed "fixes" which prevent underclassmen from getting such obscene payouts, but the problem is, even if this were passed, you'd still wind up with a glaring issue: an upperclassman who proves himself at an FCS or G5 school then enters the Portal and goes to the highest bidder. It solves nothing. The best thing the NCAA could've done -- and I'm afraid they totally missed the boat on this -- would've been to treat college athletes as employees, and then set a wage scale which all NCAA schools had to adopt. Since they fought this tooth and nail, we're stuck with the current situation, which is destroying what used to make college sports so great. Any system that pays players will forever change/destroy what was once beautiful. When money becomes an athletes motivation then it has become a professional sport and along with that comes the same attitudes that have made pro football the stinkfest it is now. I knew pro football was trash when I saw a running back slide to avoid a tackle. This lack of heart is not college football but it will be very soon. It will take some kind of miracle to save it now that the ball is rolling.
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Post by brother on Jun 27, 2023 16:50:02 GMT -6
The problem with this is, it takes more than a "marketable" QB or star WR or EDGE to win. Teams need linemen on both sides of the ball, who, except at the absolute top of the scale (i.e., future Top 5 draft picks) operate in relative anonymity. And those guys aren't going to collect anything without some form of teamwide collective. The only exceptions might be those schools who have a "War Pigs" style nickname for a unit that might pull in some corporate interest. The same goes for individual jersey sales, etc. Your starting QB might sell thousands of dollars worth of his NIL gear, but unless you have the next Gronk on your team, your starting TE will only sell a fraction of that. And most coaches want a TE who can get the job done, whether he's Gronk or not. So schools which are able start collectives which in turn pay competitive "salaries" to every scholarship player, proven or not. The schools at the top of the food chain take it a step farther, and provide what amounts to signing bonuses, which can reach 6 or even 7 figures for prized recruits. This is the part that's gotten totally out of hand. I've seen proposed "fixes" which prevent underclassmen from getting such obscene payouts, but the problem is, even if this were passed, you'd still wind up with a glaring issue: an upperclassman who proves himself at an FCS or G5 school then enters the Portal and goes to the highest bidder. It solves nothing. The best thing the NCAA could've done -- and I'm afraid they totally missed the boat on this -- would've been to treat college athletes as employees, and then set a wage scale which all NCAA schools had to adopt. Since they fought this tooth and nail, we're stuck with the current situation, which is destroying what used to make college sports so great. Any system that pays players will forever change/destroy what was once beautiful. When money becomes an athletes motivation then it has become a professional sport and along with that comes the same attitudes that have made pro football the stinkfest it is now. I knew pro football was trash when I saw a running back slide to avoid a tackle. This lack of heart is not college football but it will be very soon. It will take some kind of miracle to save it now that the ball is rolling. I don't disagree, but it's already here. Back in the 70's-90's, did you ever think you would see players opting out of bowl games? That's been happening every year now for awhile.
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Post by Cleburneslim on Jun 27, 2023 18:29:03 GMT -6
Any system that pays players will forever change/destroy what was once beautiful. When money becomes an athletes motivation then it has become a professional sport and along with that comes the same attitudes that have made pro football the stinkfest it is now. I knew pro football was trash when I saw a running back slide to avoid a tackle. This lack of heart is not college football but it will be very soon. It will take some kind of miracle to save it now that the ball is rolling. I don't disagree, but it's already here. Back in the 70's-90's, did you ever think you would see players opting out of bowl games? That's been happening every year now for awhile. Remember when that was the goal of a season/career now it's NC or I'm out. Even this was caused by the promise of money next year after the draft.
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Post by helenagamecock on Oct 19, 2023 14:50:55 GMT -6
NIL is why Im starting to be a fan of smaller schools like Jax State ( son will attend) and South Alabama (daughter attends). I'm tired of these high school kids thinking their market value is several hundred thousand dollars before they ever take a snap of college ball. Its sick knowing a SEC QB is driving around town in a $75k new truck and trowing 3 int's every Saturday.
NIL was ment for the Bryce Youngs and other elite proven athletes to get paid for doing thigs like Nissan and Dr Pepper commercials. NIL was not to pay a monthly $3k payment to a scout team / special teams player who is aready getting a full ride scholarship.
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Post by Whup Em All on Oct 19, 2023 16:19:27 GMT -6
NIL was ment for the Bryce Youngs and other elite proven athletes to get paid for doing thigs like Nissan and Dr Pepper commercials. NIL was not to pay a monthly $3k payment to a scout team / special teams player who is aready getting a full ride scholarship. I know people who feel the exact opposite of you on this. They want NIL to give spending money to athletes, not allow a star player to drive a Lambo. I think both extremes are right. And both extremes are wrong. And as I've said for ages now... the NCAA screwed the pooch on this whole thing when they didn't vote to allow (regulated) cash payments to student athletes. Minimum wage, X number of hours per week. Kind of like how any other student can get paid for working for the college on top of being on a full academic scholarship. Heck, in some cases, kids are able to stack academic scholarships and effectively set themselves up with nice fat stipends. If they'd done THIS MUCH, NIL would never have gotten legs. Now, the genie is out of the bottle. Good luck getting it back in.
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Post by Cleburneslim on Oct 19, 2023 20:58:10 GMT -6
Didn't the supreme court decide that you couldn't restrict a man's ability to earn money frome his name and likeness. If coke wants to give to Webb for a commercial or event then so be it, the problem comes when the school athletics are paying players to play. This is simply an employee employer arrangement and not a man earning from his likeness or name. This monster must be controlled or it will destroy everyone and everything who comes into contact with it.
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Post by Whup Em All on Oct 20, 2023 11:07:04 GMT -6
Didn't the supreme court decide that you couldn't restrict a man's ability to earn money frome his name and likeness. If coke wants to give to Webb for a commercial or event then so be it, the problem comes when the school athletics are paying players to play. This is simply an employee employer arrangement and not a man earning from his likeness or name. This monster must be controlled or it will destroy everyone and everything who comes into contact with it. I think a blend of the two is what is needed: 1) Allow players to benefit from name and likeness (jersey sales, autograph signings, paid public appearances, etc.) but regulate this for the protection of the athletes. (For instance, you wouldn't want Miguel "El Carnicero" Guzman flying your star quarterback to Honduras for a special appearance at his daughter's birthday party.) Maybe have all scheduling and payment handled through the university so it can be cleared, but otherwise, let the players make as much as they can make. This extra step would also help protect players when it comes to taxes, etc. The player fills out a W-4 and gets a paycheck from his school with taxes withheld, rather than having to keep track of all this as a 1099. I know, I know... this requires more money from each school. But it's a far better system. 2) All scholarship athletes get a basic stipend in addition to their scholarships. Not much... just like a basic minimum wage student job, maybe $145 gross each week. But enough to give the kids some cash in their pockets. The key is, this would be both MANDATED and STANDARDIZED so that the stipend could NOT be used as a recruiting tool. This would be incredibly expensive, of course -- close to $2M a year per school in additional expenses -- but you could put limits on it, at least in some sports. Maybe it only pays during the regular season and officially authorized preseason/postseason practices and rehearsals. That would cut the cost considerably. Still expensive, but then, so are college sports.
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Post by brother on Oct 20, 2023 12:08:47 GMT -6
Didn't the supreme court decide that you couldn't restrict a man's ability to earn money frome his name and likeness. If coke wants to give to Webb for a commercial or event then so be it, the problem comes when the school athletics are paying players to play. This is simply an employee employer arrangement and not a man earning from his likeness or name. This monster must be controlled or it will destroy everyone and everything who comes into contact with it. I think a blend of the two is what is needed: 1) Allow players to benefit from name and likeness (jersey sales, autograph signings, paid public appearances, etc.) but regulate this for the protection of the athletes. (For instance, you wouldn't want Miguel "El Carnicero" Guzman flying your star quarterback to Honduras for a special appearance at his daughter's birthday party.) Maybe have all scheduling and payment handled through the university so it can be cleared, but otherwise, let the players make as much as they can make. This extra step would also help protect players when it comes to taxes, etc. The player fills out a W-4 and gets a paycheck from his school with taxes withheld, rather than having to keep track of all this as a 1099. I know, I know... this requires more money from each school. But it's a far better system. 2) All scholarship athletes get a basic stipend in addition to their scholarships. Not much... just like a basic minimum wage student job, maybe $145 gross each week. But enough to give the kids some cash in their pockets. The key is, this would be both MANDATED and STANDARDIZED so that the stipend could NOT be used as a recruiting tool. This would be incredibly expensive, of course -- close to $2M a year per school in additional expenses -- but you could put limits on it, at least in some sports. Maybe it only pays during the regular season and officially authorized preseason/postseason practices and rehearsals. That would cut the cost considerably. Still expensive, but then, so are college sports. The kids getting paid by the university is a non starter for the NCAA. That is a hill they are willing to die on. If the players are classified as employees, it threatens the tax exempt status of the whole system.
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Post by Whup Em All on Oct 20, 2023 14:06:29 GMT -6
I think a blend of the two is what is needed: 1) Allow players to benefit from name and likeness (jersey sales, autograph signings, paid public appearances, etc.) but regulate this for the protection of the athletes. (For instance, you wouldn't want Miguel "El Carnicero" Guzman flying your star quarterback to Honduras for a special appearance at his daughter's birthday party.) Maybe have all scheduling and payment handled through the university so it can be cleared, but otherwise, let the players make as much as they can make. This extra step would also help protect players when it comes to taxes, etc. The player fills out a W-4 and gets a paycheck from his school with taxes withheld, rather than having to keep track of all this as a 1099. I know, I know... this requires more money from each school. But it's a far better system. 2) All scholarship athletes get a basic stipend in addition to their scholarships. Not much... just like a basic minimum wage student job, maybe $145 gross each week. But enough to give the kids some cash in their pockets. The key is, this would be both MANDATED and STANDARDIZED so that the stipend could NOT be used as a recruiting tool. This would be incredibly expensive, of course -- close to $2M a year per school in additional expenses -- but you could put limits on it, at least in some sports. Maybe it only pays during the regular season and officially authorized preseason/postseason practices and rehearsals. That would cut the cost considerably. Still expensive, but then, so are college sports. The kids getting paid by the university is a non starter for the NCAA. That is a hill they are willing to die on. If the players are classified as employees, it threatens the tax exempt status of the whole system. But it shouldn't ... nonprofits can pay their employees. Doing so is 100% legal.
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