|
Post by pubdaze on Sept 21, 2023 11:44:42 GMT -6
I just posted this as a reply on another thread, but it fits this overall thread better, so I moved it: I don't want to rush too quickly to defend the University here, since they've made PLENTY of blunders in regards to the way they've handled capital campaigns and capital improvement projects in recent years. But just for this specific case... let's look at the north stands project: 1) The original renderings included both the football operations center (field house) and a dorm/dining hall project, all of which would be tied together and would stretch from the field house location around the corner down Trustee Circle for 100-plus yards. This project (and its associated renderings) was ABANDONED due to cost, both due to the supply chain issues going on a year or so ago (Remember those? When you were a rich man if you owned a couple of 2x4s?) and due to the building engineers informing them that this particular stretch of Trustee Circle is a horrifically lousy place to build a dorm, and would need probably millions of dollars of improvements just to be sound enough to lay a foundation. 2) With the original idea abandoned, the University chose to put the dorm over by Crow Hall and the dining facility on the former site of Weatherly Hall, between Curtiss Hall and Mason Hall. The football operations center would be a standalone project. So the field house was demolished and construction began. 3) Now here's where the confusion begins. What fans wanted was to see a "STADIUM improvement project" which included both the field house AND the north stands. What we got was ONLY the field house. The University failed here to say, PUBLICLY AND ON THE RECORD, "We're working with the architects to come up with a totally new plan for the north end of the stadium, which will include demolition of the old press box as well as new luxury seating options. Construction on this new project is expected to begin shortly after completion of the football operations center." What we DID get, publicly, was crickets. "Hey everybody! Look at progress on the demolition of the field house!" "But what about the old press box?" "Did you see this drone video of a crane knocking down a wall of the old field house?" "Yeah, but the old press box?" "Wow! Would you look at that hole in the ground! That used to be the field house!" 4) So while I'm as irritated by that last bullet point as everyone else, I'll play devil's advocate on this point. Since construction on the north stands wouldn't be slated to begin for at least 2 years from when the original project was canceled, the University was not faced with a rushed deadline to come up with an alternate plan for this side of the stadium. They've been able to research and discuss innovative new ideas (such as a version of MSU's "The Balconies") which may work better in the limited footprint available, and have been able to take their time to insure that, at the end of the day, this project is befitting of an FBS stadium. Since these discussions are ongoing, there are no renderings to release or public statements to be made regarding concrete plans for the north stands. But this should not be confused with "lack of a plan" or "not knowing what they're doing". When they have something to release, it will be released, and -- one hopes -- it will be awesome. 5) With devil's advocate now played, I'll jump back to critical fan mode: it boils down to COMMUNICATION. I understand (as I'm sure most of us would) the lack of hard details and renderings about the new project. If they were releasing statements on a regular basis stating the current ideas being discussed, it WOULD make them look totally incompetent: "We're planning to have 10 luxury suites!" "No, five luxury suites and a new concession stand!" "No, a concession stand and a press area..." "Hey, we're back to ten luxury suites and a concession stand! The architect thinks he can do this!" "Scratch that plan. Engineers didn't agree. Screw this! We'll just do chairback seats along the entire stands." "Someone mentioned adding a bourbon slide! We've all started drinking heavily and think this is a swell idea! We're also replacing the visitor's locker rooms with a unicorn breeding facility. It will be the first of its kind in Alabama!" 6) So we've established that releasing hard details during the planning stage is a bad idea. But so is ignoring this project completely. We have deprecated renderings floating around that show a monstrous dorm/suites/seating project that's never going to be built, with very little if any public statements from the University about what WILL be going there instead, or even that it's still actively being designed. We have no ETA's on when we can expect renderings. We have no public, on-the-record statements about what HAS been decided, or when we can expect little things like when the old press box will come down. It's not incompetence. It's a lack of COMMUNICATION. 7) Communication, it seems, is tied closely to another core concept which has historically eluded Jacksonville State. It starts with an "M". We offer a degree in it. Maybe someone should talk to those guys. Didn't the university offer a degree in "Communications" at one point? Maybe they still do? It goes hand in hand with that "M" thing.
|
|
|
Post by Cleburneslim on Sept 21, 2023 17:00:18 GMT -6
I just posted this as a reply on another thread, but it fits this overall thread better, so I moved it: I don't want to rush too quickly to defend the University here, since they've made PLENTY of blunders in regards to the way they've handled capital campaigns and capital improvement projects in recent years. But just for this specific case... let's look at the north stands project: 1) The original renderings included both the football operations center (field house) and a dorm/dining hall project, all of which would be tied together and would stretch from the field house location around the corner down Trustee Circle for 100-plus yards. This project (and its associated renderings) was ABANDONED due to cost, both due to the supply chain issues going on a year or so ago (Remember those? When you were a rich man if you owned a couple of 2x4s?) and due to the building engineers informing them that this particular stretch of Trustee Circle is a horrifically lousy place to build a dorm, and would need probably millions of dollars of improvements just to be sound enough to lay a foundation. 2) With the original idea abandoned, the University chose to put the dorm over by Crow Hall and the dining facility on the former site of Weatherly Hall, between Curtiss Hall and Mason Hall. The football operations center would be a standalone project. So the field house was demolished and construction began. 3) Now here's where the confusion begins. What fans wanted was to see a "STADIUM improvement project" which included both the field house AND the north stands. What we got was ONLY the field house. The University failed here to say, PUBLICLY AND ON THE RECORD, "We're working with the architects to come up with a totally new plan for the north end of the stadium, which will include demolition of the old press box as well as new luxury seating options. Construction on this new project is expected to begin shortly after completion of the football operations center." What we DID get, publicly, was crickets. "Hey everybody! Look at progress on the demolition of the field house!" "But what about the old press box?" "Did you see this drone video of a crane knocking down a wall of the old field house?" "Yeah, but the old press box?" "Wow! Would you look at that hole in the ground! That used to be the field house!" 4) So while I'm as irritated by that last bullet point as everyone else, I'll play devil's advocate on this point. Since construction on the north stands wouldn't be slated to begin for at least 2 years from when the original project was canceled, the University was not faced with a rushed deadline to come up with an alternate plan for this side of the stadium. They've been able to research and discuss innovative new ideas (such as a version of MSU's "The Balconies") which may work better in the limited footprint available, and have been able to take their time to insure that, at the end of the day, this project is befitting of an FBS stadium. Since these discussions are ongoing, there are no renderings to release or public statements to be made regarding concrete plans for the north stands. But this should not be confused with "lack of a plan" or "not knowing what they're doing". When they have something to release, it will be released, and -- one hopes -- it will be awesome. 5) With devil's advocate now played, I'll jump back to critical fan mode: it boils down to COMMUNICATION. I understand (as I'm sure most of us would) the lack of hard details and renderings about the new project. If they were releasing statements on a regular basis stating the current ideas being discussed, it WOULD make them look totally incompetent: "We're planning to have 10 luxury suites!" "No, five luxury suites and a new concession stand!" "No, a concession stand and a press area..." "Hey, we're back to ten luxury suites and a concession stand! The architect thinks he can do this!" "Scratch that plan. Engineers didn't agree. Screw this! We'll just do chairback seats along the entire stands." "Someone mentioned adding a bourbon slide! We've all started drinking heavily and think this is a swell idea! We're also replacing the visitor's locker rooms with a unicorn breeding facility. It will be the first of its kind in Alabama!" 6) So we've established that releasing hard details during the planning stage is a bad idea. But so is ignoring this project completely. We have deprecated renderings floating around that show a monstrous dorm/suites/seating project that's never going to be built, with very little if any public statements from the University about what WILL be going there instead, or even that it's still actively being designed. We have no ETA's on when we can expect renderings. We have no public, on-the-record statements about what HAS been decided, or when we can expect little things like when the old press box will come down. It's not incompetence. It's a lack of COMMUNICATION. 7) Communication, it seems, is tied closely to another core concept which has historically eluded Jacksonville State. It starts with an "M". We offer a degree in it. Maybe someone should talk to those guys. How much could it cost to repair the current cement stands and add chair back seating. Tearing down the press box should be cheap and easy. It would be acceptable to leave the top level of the stands as is for a year or two until financing cam be arranged for something great. It is embarrassing to enter fbs with an ugly eyesore for half the stadium. The visitors half that we expect them to travel too and sit on concrete slabs. Come on man.
|
|
|
Post by jsu02 on Sept 21, 2023 17:26:30 GMT -6
I just posted this as a reply on another thread, but it fits this overall thread better, so I moved it: I don't want to rush too quickly to defend the University here, since they've made PLENTY of blunders in regards to the way they've handled capital campaigns and capital improvement projects in recent years. But just for this specific case... let's look at the north stands project: 1) The original renderings included both the football operations center (field house) and a dorm/dining hall project, all of which would be tied together and would stretch from the field house location around the corner down Trustee Circle for 100-plus yards. This project (and its associated renderings) was ABANDONED due to cost, both due to the supply chain issues going on a year or so ago (Remember those? When you were a rich man if you owned a couple of 2x4s?) and due to the building engineers informing them that this particular stretch of Trustee Circle is a horrifically lousy place to build a dorm, and would need probably millions of dollars of improvements just to be sound enough to lay a foundation. 2) With the original idea abandoned, the University chose to put the dorm over by Crow Hall and the dining facility on the former site of Weatherly Hall, between Curtiss Hall and Mason Hall. The football operations center would be a standalone project. So the field house was demolished and construction began. 3) Now here's where the confusion begins. What fans wanted was to see a "STADIUM improvement project" which included both the field house AND the north stands. What we got was ONLY the field house. The University failed here to say, PUBLICLY AND ON THE RECORD, "We're working with the architects to come up with a totally new plan for the north end of the stadium, which will include demolition of the old press box as well as new luxury seating options. Construction on this new project is expected to begin shortly after completion of the football operations center." What we DID get, publicly, was crickets. "Hey everybody! Look at progress on the demolition of the field house!" "But what about the old press box?" "Did you see this drone video of a crane knocking down a wall of the old field house?" "Yeah, but the old press box?" "Wow! Would you look at that hole in the ground! That used to be the field house!" 4) So while I'm as irritated by that last bullet point as everyone else, I'll play devil's advocate on this point. Since construction on the north stands wouldn't be slated to begin for at least 2 years from when the original project was canceled, the University was not faced with a rushed deadline to come up with an alternate plan for this side of the stadium. They've been able to research and discuss innovative new ideas (such as a version of MSU's "The Balconies") which may work better in the limited footprint available, and have been able to take their time to insure that, at the end of the day, this project is befitting of an FBS stadium. Since these discussions are ongoing, there are no renderings to release or public statements to be made regarding concrete plans for the north stands. But this should not be confused with "lack of a plan" or "not knowing what they're doing". When they have something to release, it will be released, and -- one hopes -- it will be awesome. 5) With devil's advocate now played, I'll jump back to critical fan mode: it boils down to COMMUNICATION. I understand (as I'm sure most of us would) the lack of hard details and renderings about the new project. If they were releasing statements on a regular basis stating the current ideas being discussed, it WOULD make them look totally incompetent: "We're planning to have 10 luxury suites!" "No, five luxury suites and a new concession stand!" "No, a concession stand and a press area..." "Hey, we're back to ten luxury suites and a concession stand! The architect thinks he can do this!" "Scratch that plan. Engineers didn't agree. Screw this! We'll just do chairback seats along the entire stands." "Someone mentioned adding a bourbon slide! We've all started drinking heavily and think this is a swell idea! We're also replacing the visitor's locker rooms with a unicorn breeding facility. It will be the first of its kind in Alabama!" 6) So we've established that releasing hard details during the planning stage is a bad idea. But so is ignoring this project completely. We have deprecated renderings floating around that show a monstrous dorm/suites/seating project that's never going to be built, with very little if any public statements from the University about what WILL be going there instead, or even that it's still actively being designed. We have no ETA's on when we can expect renderings. We have no public, on-the-record statements about what HAS been decided, or when we can expect little things like when the old press box will come down. It's not incompetence. It's a lack of COMMUNICATION. 7) Communication, it seems, is tied closely to another core concept which has historically eluded Jacksonville State. It starts with an "M". We offer a degree in it. Maybe someone should talk to those guys. How much could it cost to repair the current cement stands and add chair back seating. Tearing down the press box should be cheap and easy. It would be acceptable to leave the top level of the stands as is for a year or two until financing cam be arranged for something great. It is embarrassing to enter fbs with an ugly eyesore for half the stadium. The visitors half that we expect them to travel too and sit on concrete slabs. Come on man. I agree. Very embarrassing. I still find it hard to believe this was even allowed to happen...
|
|
|
Post by leeroy on Sept 21, 2023 19:53:55 GMT -6
How much could it cost to repair the current cement stands and add chair back seating. Tearing down the press box should be cheap and easy. It would be acceptable to leave the top level of the stands as is for a year or two until financing cam be arranged for something great. It is embarrassing to enter fbs with an ugly eyesore for half the stadium. The visitors half that we expect them to travel too and sit on concrete slabs. Come on man. I agree. Very embarrassing. I still find it hard to believe this was even allowed to happen... It's clear we weren't prepared once the original plan blew up. The concrete is sad. I'm guessing we are keeping the old pressbox for now due to TV considerations.
|
|
|
Post by sprout203 on Sept 21, 2023 20:51:37 GMT -6
if I am not mistaken, the field has to shift or the new field house will be "off center." Someone on the CUSA board pointed out that the football operations center is off-center anyway. Not the location of the footprint -- the design itself. The northern half of the new field house has three sections. The southern half only has two. It doesn't bother me much, but folks with OCD will probably go nuts. LOL. I'll admit, it is difficult to un-see. Hopefully, it won't be as noticeable in person as it is in the renderings. It is mostly about the perception that something was not done correctly when it looks off center.Visitors will look at it and wonder what happened.
|
|
|
Post by ntxgamecock on Sept 21, 2023 22:25:49 GMT -6
I just posted this as a reply on another thread, but it fits this overall thread better, so I moved it: I don't want to rush too quickly to defend the University here, since they've made PLENTY of blunders in regards to the way they've handled capital campaigns and capital improvement projects in recent years. But just for this specific case... let's look at the north stands project: 1) The original renderings included both the football operations center (field house) and a dorm/dining hall project, all of which would be tied together and would stretch from the field house location around the corner down Trustee Circle for 100-plus yards. This project (and its associated renderings) was ABANDONED due to cost, both due to the supply chain issues going on a year or so ago (Remember those? When you were a rich man if you owned a couple of 2x4s?) and due to the building engineers informing them that this particular stretch of Trustee Circle is a horrifically lousy place to build a dorm, and would need probably millions of dollars of improvements just to be sound enough to lay a foundation. 2) With the original idea abandoned, the University chose to put the dorm over by Crow Hall and the dining facility on the former site of Weatherly Hall, between Curtiss Hall and Mason Hall. The football operations center would be a standalone project. So the field house was demolished and construction began. 3) Now here's where the confusion begins. What fans wanted was to see a "STADIUM improvement project" which included both the field house AND the north stands. What we got was ONLY the field house. The University failed here to say, PUBLICLY AND ON THE RECORD, "We're working with the architects to come up with a totally new plan for the north end of the stadium, which will include demolition of the old press box as well as new luxury seating options. Construction on this new project is expected to begin shortly after completion of the football operations center." What we DID get, publicly, was crickets. "Hey everybody! Look at progress on the demolition of the field house!" "But what about the old press box?" "Did you see this drone video of a crane knocking down a wall of the old field house?" "Yeah, but the old press box?" "Wow! Would you look at that hole in the ground! That used to be the field house!" 4) So while I'm as irritated by that last bullet point as everyone else, I'll play devil's advocate on this point. Since construction on the north stands wouldn't be slated to begin for at least 2 years from when the original project was canceled, the University was not faced with a rushed deadline to come up with an alternate plan for this side of the stadium. They've been able to research and discuss innovative new ideas (such as a version of MSU's "The Balconies") which may work better in the limited footprint available, and have been able to take their time to insure that, at the end of the day, this project is befitting of an FBS stadium. Since these discussions are ongoing, there are no renderings to release or public statements to be made regarding concrete plans for the north stands. But this should not be confused with "lack of a plan" or "not knowing what they're doing". When they have something to release, it will be released, and -- one hopes -- it will be awesome. 5) With devil's advocate now played, I'll jump back to critical fan mode: it boils down to COMMUNICATION. I understand (as I'm sure most of us would) the lack of hard details and renderings about the new project. If they were releasing statements on a regular basis stating the current ideas being discussed, it WOULD make them look totally incompetent: "We're planning to have 10 luxury suites!" "No, five luxury suites and a new concession stand!" "No, a concession stand and a press area..." "Hey, we're back to ten luxury suites and a concession stand! The architect thinks he can do this!" "Scratch that plan. Engineers didn't agree. Screw this! We'll just do chairback seats along the entire stands." "Someone mentioned adding a bourbon slide! We've all started drinking heavily and think this is a swell idea! We're also replacing the visitor's locker rooms with a unicorn breeding facility. It will be the first of its kind in Alabama!" 6) So we've established that releasing hard details during the planning stage is a bad idea. But so is ignoring this project completely. We have deprecated renderings floating around that show a monstrous dorm/suites/seating project that's never going to be built, with very little if any public statements from the University about what WILL be going there instead, or even that it's still actively being designed. We have no ETA's on when we can expect renderings. We have no public, on-the-record statements about what HAS been decided, or when we can expect little things like when the old press box will come down. It's not incompetence. It's a lack of COMMUNICATION. 7) Communication, it seems, is tied closely to another core concept which has historically eluded Jacksonville State. It starts with an "M". We offer a degree in it. Maybe someone should talk to those guys. Didn't the university offer a degree in "Communications" at one point? Maybe they still do? It goes hand in hand with that "M" thing. Yes. I have one, and this lack of said communication infuriates me almost as much as the apparent lack of that M word that we now seem to be avoiding like it was the name of the county seat of Pike County. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
|
|
|
Post by pubdaze on Sept 22, 2023 6:02:07 GMT -6
Didn't the university offer a degree in "Communications" at one point? Maybe they still do? It goes hand in hand with that "M" thing. Yes. I have one, and this lack of said communication infuriates me almost as much as the apparent lack of that M word that we now seem to be avoiding like it was the name of the county seat of Pike County. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Right. I have one of those with degrees with the "M" on it so I feel ya.
|
|
|
Post by gemofthehills on Sept 22, 2023 6:28:48 GMT -6
Does anyone have any thoughts on why these things are not spoken about to friends of the university? It has been an issue forever and I cant come up with a good reason as to why the University doesnt market itself nor why future growth and plans arent broadcasted to the world. Most media outlets are looking for something new (like trying to decide dinner after eating the same thing over and over). Public institutions seem to get near the front of the line from media outlets for little or no cost and social media has little cost. Anyways, if anyone can explain please do.
|
|
|
Post by jsu02 on Sept 22, 2023 7:56:44 GMT -6
boxlifeusa.com/boxsuites/It would require taking out several rows along the top, but some of these on the north side would be pretty cool.
|
|
|
Post by Whup Em All on Sept 22, 2023 9:57:08 GMT -6
Does anyone have any thoughts on why these things are not spoken about to friends of the university? It has been an issue forever and I cant come up with a good reason as to why the University doesnt market itself nor why future growth and plans arent broadcasted to the world. Most media outlets are looking for something new (like trying to decide dinner after eating the same thing over and over). Public institutions seem to get near the front of the line from media outlets for little or no cost and social media has little cost. Anyways, if anyone can explain please do. The only theory I have is nepotism. I once applied for a job at JSU and found out later the job had already been filled before it was even posted. The posting was just done "for legal reasons." A few years later, I learned I was (by far) not the only person with that same experience. Joe Smith works a student job in the Department of Doing Things. He graduates. The Department of Doing Things creates a full-time position duplicating the responsibilities Joe once handled as a student. They post the job for 30 days or whatever is legally required, then they hire Joe to fill it. Joe is now a full-time employee, doing the same job he did as a student worker. An outsider tells them, "You should do this new thing instead!" and they reply, "We're doing all the things we can do with the budget we're given. We don't have the money or staff to do that new thing. We just had to hire a full-time worker just to continue doing the things we were already doing." Rinse and repeat.
|
|
|
Post by jaxstatealum on Sept 22, 2023 10:01:56 GMT -6
Whup - I know Joe...
Reality is these things happen not just at our beloved Jax State. It is for the most part the law of life. Not right, but reality.
|
|
|
Post by pubdaze on Sept 22, 2023 12:51:36 GMT -6
boxlifeusa.com/boxsuites/It would require taking out several rows along the top, but some of these on the north side would be pretty cool. Well those are pretty cool. Look at the Peay getting all creative but hey, did you see the construction going on in our end-zone? See, look over there...
|
|
|
Post by leeroy on Sept 22, 2023 15:37:07 GMT -6
boxlifeusa.com/boxsuites/It would require taking out several rows along the top, but some of these on the north side would be pretty cool. Well those are pretty cool. Look at the Peay getting all creative but hey, did you see the construction going on in our end-zone? See, look over there... I remember seeing those the last time we traveled to Clarksville. They did look cool, but it makes your endzone look weird if that's all that's there. Now, if we were to demolish the press box and set a few of those in its place, I might be on board.
|
|
|
Post by Cleburneslim on Sept 22, 2023 20:24:45 GMT -6
If anyone here we're willing to pay 20k a year to rent one of these, they'd all be in a suite already. Why not do something people can or will be able to use. Perhaps some of you can afford that but I'd bet 99% of us can't. I'd prefer something that would actually add to the GameDay experience for the fans and not for a few corporate people who don't care about the game.
|
|
|
Post by jsu02 on Sept 22, 2023 20:33:19 GMT -6
If anyone here we're willing to pay 20k a year to rent one of these, they'd all be in a suite already. Why not do something people can or will be able to use. Perhaps some of you can afford that but I'd bet 99% of us can't. I'd prefer something that would actually add to the GameDay experience for the fans and not for a few corporate people who don't care about the game. Not necessarily. The current suites offer a sterile vibe since the windows don't open. I know several people who aren't interested in paying for that but would for something that would open
|
|